Me, Myself, and I are Here

您好，由于缺乏维护和兼容问题，维基媒体基金会和社群有意弃用结构式讨论（又称Flow），现在使用结构式讨论的讨论页未来将转换成Wikitext（维基文本）。因为您的讨论页启用了结构式讨论，所以向您递送此消息。我们邀请您参与相关讨论，并建议您先行考虑关闭此功能。如有问题，亦可至互助客栈求助区留言。給您帶來的不便，我們深表歉意。

Hi,

glad to meet you! I am a Chinese student who is doing a Wiki Translation project on campus. I've read the article Pig-faced women recently and it's really fascinating that I want to translate it into Chinese. And I noticed that you are doing the translating work as well. So I wonder if you are going to finish it in the next few weeks? If not, could I translate it as my project work?

Hi,

Nice to meet you, too!

No, I cannot finish the draft in that time, especially not alone, so I'll gladly pass it off to you!

I cannot do that right now, but I will delete or hand over my draft as soon as I'm able. Remind me if I haven't done this in a day.

I would like to add that I think that it's very interesting project and article choice. Good luck with it, and thank you for your work!

Thank you for giving that chance to me. I know you want to translate that article because you also take interests in that fantastic legend. I promise that I'll try my best to do the translation work and hope you can also help editing after I publish it!

By the way, your name is really interesting too.

; )

Thank you :)

You should be able to start on your project now!

Just now I saw snoring rail in enwiki's FA archive, but in zhwiki the article is not even created; so I went to Content Translation and saw you currently translating it.

Well, based on what you said on your User page, I guess you'll probably just do the machine translation and no more, right? So, could you please just click on every paragraph (so that the machine does its part in the translation "chores"), and publish it out into Draft:鼾声秧鸡 (an in-fact literal translation I found online that sounds quite good)? Then the Chinese community (maybe I'm not alone) can feed on this nice exotic pheasant.

Regards and Cheers :)

Hi,

That's correct, I did tinker a little with that page! You are correct, I was testing out the Content Translation tool / my own knowledge of Chinese as well as trying to improve my translation skills more than anything, since I don't have much experience with translation / am not a great writer in Chinese. I am happy to hear others are interested in taking up this page. I changed the draft to an open one. Please let me know if it didn't work!

谢谢，

~~~~

I see. Well, I don't really want to give too much "negative views" to a new user of ContentTranslation like you, but my recent user experience is really modest.
Initially I was trying to translate yesterday's main-page FA β-ydroxy β-methylbutyric acid, but the translation blew up pathetically (see my 沙盒); then I was actually forced to use my puppet to publish the translation again, omitting those paragraphs with "landmines" (see Draft:β-羟基-β-甲基丁酸).
Just after that, I was chatting with people, and was told that there is something called Google Translator Toolkit. The translation quality of both the "language" and the "code" is so good, I even dedicated a well-prepared diff edit to demonstrate that point.

Anyways, the code of our snoring rail is hopefully not that complicated, and you'll probably get a reasonable OK output. My previous message to you was actually requesting you to "spit it out" ASAP (because when one editor is translating using ContTransl, other editors are not allowed to do the translation, until the translation is published or deleted); but now I don't need to worry too much, I've got Google Translator Toolkit!

And you don't need to sign ~~~~ in the Flow interface.

Ah, thanks! I'm learning quite a lot. I published the draft as soon as possible (so it's clear for other editors to start translations if they want), and I did tweak it a bit afterwards -- the output was so wrong it was funny in a lot of places, and some references/paragraphs were omitted so I added them back in. It's at the title you specified: Draft:鼾声秧鸡. I'll leave it to better translators now :)

I'm now curious to see how different the Translator Toolkit output is...

OK, I submitted the Toolkit version just now. The 导轨/轨（rail in railway）is an obviously unavoidable error; I guess you probably manually tweaked the 鼾声秧鸡 while in ContentTranslation tool (the machine didn't recognize the bird, did it?). But the sentence flow looks better in general ... well it's quite hard to demonstrate over this chat which sentences are better flowed, I'll name a few:

• 它以小螃蟹和其他小蜥蜴为食 is better than
  它滋生于小螃蟹和其他可能小的猎物，如蜥蜴
• 铁轨是一个庞大且非常普遍的家庭，有近150种。它们是中小型陆地或湿地鸟类，它们的短身体通常侧向扁平化以帮助它们穿过茂密的植被。is better than
  这鸟是一种大型的和非常广泛的家庭中，有将近150种。 它们是小型到中型、陆地或湿地鸟类和他们的短机构往往是横向压扁以帮助她们移动，穿过茂密的植被。
• 该物种的典型栖息地是潮湿地区的茂密植被。这可能包括森林中难以穿越的竹子和藤本植物 ，再生林中的藤条 ，或Minahassa半岛山坡上的象草和灌木丛。is better than
  典型的栖息地的这种密集的植被湿地区。 这可能包括坚不可摧的 竹子 和藤本植物在森林藤在再生长的森林，或 象草 和灌木丛山坡上的 Minahassa半岛的。

Well, I'm not really advertising Google or anything, the sentence quality is so far better. That's OK though, machine translated text needs to be polished anyways.

Another aspect of quality, as I said, is of the code; for this aspect, Google Toolkit doesn' seem to have too much an advantage. The main advantages are: 100% retention of refs, templates, etc, due to its more mature code recognition I guess; and probably less spaces between words or around punctuations and refs (Chinese language doesn't want spaces).

Anyways, it turns out (today) that I'm going to be quite busy in the near future ... so please forgive me if I don't follow up much the "polishing" ... I'll try to attract other editors' attention, if I start to have no time editing at all ... and don't worry about being deleted, it's a Draft, and is regarded created as article only when moved to the (main) namespace 鼾声秧鸡.

That is a lot better. The spacing is really a plus, the code recognition is nice, and the sentences just feel like less of a jumble (I'm slightly better at reading Chinese than writing it. Production is harder than recognition). I did manually find/replace those terms because it was cracking me up. Hope you don't mind if I tweak the current draft a bit after this (like linking Minahassa Peninsula, replacing 导轨/轨/铁路 etc.). I'll try not to make any huge stylistic changes and stick to less controversial edits.

I haven't worked much with Drafts, but I understand namespaces work much the same across Wikipedia editions, and the technical process of moving to mainspace is similar. It's completely understandable that real life keeps you from this project, so there is nothing to forgive. (I don't have the time to start and maintain large projects myself, though there are some articles I'd love to write someday.) Hopefully more editors can help out with this draft!

I wish you the best in your real-life affairs, and thanks for this extremely educational exchange :)

"您好！

就像社群中的其他人一样，您也在使用 Flow。

使用 Flow 或考虑使用 Flow 的社群越来越多。尽管 Flow 本身在2016年并没有安排为主要研发对象，协作小组仍然对提供一个改进的结构化讨论系统有极大兴趣。

您可以通过分享您对于 Flow 的想法帮助我们在今后研发的道路上作出决定——什么应该有，什么不应该有和什么应该做出改进？

请填写这个调查问卷，这个调查问卷是由一个第三方服务商管理的。 调查问卷并不要求您提供邮箱或用户名。 参见我们的隐私政策。

感谢您对于 Flow 的意见和想法！

Trizek (WMF)，协作小组成员, 2016年9月7日 (三) 14:45 (UTC)